As some economists and probably some members of the Labour Party are warning about Reform's uncoated spending intentions characterising them as small state, Thatcherite, slash and burn is probably wide of the mark. Nationalisation isn't something Thatcher advocated for. I think you are making the same mistake that people make about Le Pen in France characterising her as some sort of Thatcherite, she isn't, her economic policies are statist, interventionist and definitely left wing.
The reality is the country cannot afford the size of State we have at the moment. We are going bust. But no politician is courageous enough to have that conversation.
Whilst the Deputy Leader elections are largely irrelevant, the Burnham support machine seems to grow and is probably more important. Although he’s been elected as Mayor of Greater Manchester that was on a 22% turnout and other than Labour fanatics almost all Mancs despise him.
So can Dodgy Burnham get into Parliament and replace Starmer?
Reform won Runcorn when 10,000 former Labour voters switched to Reform. Out of the 25 Greater Manchester seats held by Labour, only 8 have majorities that are greater than 10,000. Of those 8, Blackley is held by Labour’s only sensible MP, Graham Stringer and I doubt he’d give up his seat for Burnham. If he did, it’s definitely winnable by Reform.
Gorton is held by disgraced Labour MP Andrew Gwynne. He was forced to resign from Labour after he was exposed as making jokes at the expense of a disabled constituent whilst he was a junior health minister. Gorton could probably be won by Reform.
The others are safe seats in mainly yuppie areas but with quite ambitious MPs who are unlikely to stand aside, one of which is Dogwhistle Lucy’s own seat of Manchester Central. The others are Withington, Salford, Stockport, Stretford, Worsley and Wythenshawe.
Burnham has a job on his hands to become a Labour MP in Greater Manchester but even if he managed it, his murky past, his support for the rape gangs, awarding his wife’s company a huge low emission zone contract and continuing to support Sacha Lord, his disgraced Nighttime Czar who fiddled the Arts Council out of a £450,000 Covid grant would come back to haunt him.
I fear you’re almost a lone voice of common sense in Labour. Their drive to lower the voting age and bring in immigrants who generally vote Labour and give them the vote is against the wishes of most working class communities to protect our borders. I can’t see this changing. I would love to be proved wrong. I can’t see Labour shifting from its open borders belief (despite what they might sometimes say to the contrary).
I do sense your frustration, alas it is not a quick fix , for instance have you seen wes streeting tweet ( some say leadership pitch, but i couldn't possibly comment) with video about constituents feeling scared about going London at last weekend.
Identity politics must be put in the incinerator (sod net zero ) and condemned to the trash can of history.
Reform will win the next general election based purely on the same strategy that keir won , keir won purely by not being the tories , Reform will win purely for being the vehicle to get labour out ( tactical voting at its purist) .
Re big state / small state , i generally find people want an effective and efficient state, if the state done the what it was supposed to do ( the basics ) then people wouldn't mind , but they dont even do that yet continuously ask for more money .
The deputy leadership election to be honest is irrelevant, the party will only change and listen when they election a leader that actually represents the working class small c conservative viewpoint ( whether that person can win the labour leadership on that ticket is the bigger question)
Hmmm. Regarding Reform's economic policies, I think you're absolutely mistaken Paul. Cutting back on wasteful state spending does not mean working class areas will be devastated any more than they already are from both the Thatcher years and from decades of Labour councils spunking away ratepayers's dough on completely useless matters.
Just one example in my area of Altrincham near Manchester is the Labour controlled council buying up half the local shopping street for a fortune just when physical shopping is in terminal decline. What makes this crazy idea worse is that if locals are going to physically shop, they will travel an extra 10 minutes to the huge Trafford Centre, park for free and have access to almost every high street brand that's still going.
So what exactly is Blue Labour's economic strategy Paul and how would you and they deal with the out of control public spending that we currently suffer?
I think your slash and burn comment about Reform is a little off the mark. Whilst they are doubtless Thatcherites to some extent, there is much more nuance than that and it's meaningless today to hang such labels on parties. I fully admire your loyalty to the Labour Party and even more so your faith that they will turn things around. However, they are culturally and ideologically extreme liberalists and extreme globalists and without the bomb that Reform is setting off under the two party tradition Labour will never go back to its roots. So I'm surprised you're not rooting for Reform more, because it is only through their success that Labour will ever be forced to go back to being the party of the working class.
You called it many years ago Paul. Amazed that you stay, like General Custer surrounded by circling Indians around the wagons. You are almost alone, a last stand. Admirable.
I am going to be blunt, so you understand, and I am sure you have heard this from many others. And I am going to tell you that my background is not a million miles from yours. The Labour Party now physically disgust me. They make me sick. What/who they've embraced, who they have left behind, the working class. Their lack of understanding of real people. Labour turns my stomach. Above all the lies, the spin, the fake, the deception, the posing, virtue signalling. To me they deceived a nation to be elected. They simply care about votes, not people. Even how the march on Saturday was downplayed and any violence overplayed while ignoring the Notting Hill carnival for example. Distortion. They are also economically illiterate and just do not understand how the country feel about immigration. the wrong people are in charge, like a coup. The Khan's, Starmers etc. Fake people. Fake Party. When you think of how/why Labour was set up it is tragedy, but one can't sit around crying about it, hoping for a tomorrow that never comes. I don't see a saviour, other than yourself. The Labour Party is run by cowards.
Labour will be severely burnt in every election in the next few years because they still do not understand. They think the Gen Election vindicated them. It did not. It was a unique situation where the right of centre split (are the conservatives really right of centre any more in any case?). Just 33.8% voted Labour in a 59% turnout voted. That's less than 20% if you do the maths. Like the Conservatives, Labour will not learn until they are humiliated in the polls.
As some economists and probably some members of the Labour Party are warning about Reform's uncoated spending intentions characterising them as small state, Thatcherite, slash and burn is probably wide of the mark. Nationalisation isn't something Thatcher advocated for. I think you are making the same mistake that people make about Le Pen in France characterising her as some sort of Thatcherite, she isn't, her economic policies are statist, interventionist and definitely left wing.
The reality is the country cannot afford the size of State we have at the moment. We are going bust. But no politician is courageous enough to have that conversation.
That should be "uncosted"! Auto-moronic-correct!!!!
Whilst the Deputy Leader elections are largely irrelevant, the Burnham support machine seems to grow and is probably more important. Although he’s been elected as Mayor of Greater Manchester that was on a 22% turnout and other than Labour fanatics almost all Mancs despise him.
So can Dodgy Burnham get into Parliament and replace Starmer?
Reform won Runcorn when 10,000 former Labour voters switched to Reform. Out of the 25 Greater Manchester seats held by Labour, only 8 have majorities that are greater than 10,000. Of those 8, Blackley is held by Labour’s only sensible MP, Graham Stringer and I doubt he’d give up his seat for Burnham. If he did, it’s definitely winnable by Reform.
Gorton is held by disgraced Labour MP Andrew Gwynne. He was forced to resign from Labour after he was exposed as making jokes at the expense of a disabled constituent whilst he was a junior health minister. Gorton could probably be won by Reform.
The others are safe seats in mainly yuppie areas but with quite ambitious MPs who are unlikely to stand aside, one of which is Dogwhistle Lucy’s own seat of Manchester Central. The others are Withington, Salford, Stockport, Stretford, Worsley and Wythenshawe.
Burnham has a job on his hands to become a Labour MP in Greater Manchester but even if he managed it, his murky past, his support for the rape gangs, awarding his wife’s company a huge low emission zone contract and continuing to support Sacha Lord, his disgraced Nighttime Czar who fiddled the Arts Council out of a £450,000 Covid grant would come back to haunt him.
I fear you’re almost a lone voice of common sense in Labour. Their drive to lower the voting age and bring in immigrants who generally vote Labour and give them the vote is against the wishes of most working class communities to protect our borders. I can’t see this changing. I would love to be proved wrong. I can’t see Labour shifting from its open borders belief (despite what they might sometimes say to the contrary).
Hi Paul 👋
Good morning 😀
I do sense your frustration, alas it is not a quick fix , for instance have you seen wes streeting tweet ( some say leadership pitch, but i couldn't possibly comment) with video about constituents feeling scared about going London at last weekend.
Identity politics must be put in the incinerator (sod net zero ) and condemned to the trash can of history.
Reform will win the next general election based purely on the same strategy that keir won , keir won purely by not being the tories , Reform will win purely for being the vehicle to get labour out ( tactical voting at its purist) .
Re big state / small state , i generally find people want an effective and efficient state, if the state done the what it was supposed to do ( the basics ) then people wouldn't mind , but they dont even do that yet continuously ask for more money .
The deputy leadership election to be honest is irrelevant, the party will only change and listen when they election a leader that actually represents the working class small c conservative viewpoint ( whether that person can win the labour leadership on that ticket is the bigger question)
Sorry for the long winded ramble
Have a lovely week Paul and all others readers 😊
Hmmm. Regarding Reform's economic policies, I think you're absolutely mistaken Paul. Cutting back on wasteful state spending does not mean working class areas will be devastated any more than they already are from both the Thatcher years and from decades of Labour councils spunking away ratepayers's dough on completely useless matters.
Just one example in my area of Altrincham near Manchester is the Labour controlled council buying up half the local shopping street for a fortune just when physical shopping is in terminal decline. What makes this crazy idea worse is that if locals are going to physically shop, they will travel an extra 10 minutes to the huge Trafford Centre, park for free and have access to almost every high street brand that's still going.
So what exactly is Blue Labour's economic strategy Paul and how would you and they deal with the out of control public spending that we currently suffer?
I think your slash and burn comment about Reform is a little off the mark. Whilst they are doubtless Thatcherites to some extent, there is much more nuance than that and it's meaningless today to hang such labels on parties. I fully admire your loyalty to the Labour Party and even more so your faith that they will turn things around. However, they are culturally and ideologically extreme liberalists and extreme globalists and without the bomb that Reform is setting off under the two party tradition Labour will never go back to its roots. So I'm surprised you're not rooting for Reform more, because it is only through their success that Labour will ever be forced to go back to being the party of the working class.
You called it many years ago Paul. Amazed that you stay, like General Custer surrounded by circling Indians around the wagons. You are almost alone, a last stand. Admirable.
I am going to be blunt, so you understand, and I am sure you have heard this from many others. And I am going to tell you that my background is not a million miles from yours. The Labour Party now physically disgust me. They make me sick. What/who they've embraced, who they have left behind, the working class. Their lack of understanding of real people. Labour turns my stomach. Above all the lies, the spin, the fake, the deception, the posing, virtue signalling. To me they deceived a nation to be elected. They simply care about votes, not people. Even how the march on Saturday was downplayed and any violence overplayed while ignoring the Notting Hill carnival for example. Distortion. They are also economically illiterate and just do not understand how the country feel about immigration. the wrong people are in charge, like a coup. The Khan's, Starmers etc. Fake people. Fake Party. When you think of how/why Labour was set up it is tragedy, but one can't sit around crying about it, hoping for a tomorrow that never comes. I don't see a saviour, other than yourself. The Labour Party is run by cowards.
Labour will be severely burnt in every election in the next few years because they still do not understand. They think the Gen Election vindicated them. It did not. It was a unique situation where the right of centre split (are the conservatives really right of centre any more in any case?). Just 33.8% voted Labour in a 59% turnout voted. That's less than 20% if you do the maths. Like the Conservatives, Labour will not learn until they are humiliated in the polls.